Transgender activist Paris Lees struggled to contain her frustration when faced with Angela Epstein, a journalist who was “appalled” by a new London school which boasts being “gender-neutral”.
Highgate School, in north London will be introducing non-gender specific uniforms, allowing boys to wear skirts and children to identify with either sex.
Angela argued conservatives are looked at like “whackos” for turning their noses up at the school’s rules, which was laughed at by her impassioned sparring partner.
“You can chuckle all you like,” hissed Angela. “Why are you sniggering? Children are very vulnerable and susceptible to ideas.”
Paris fired back: “I read an article of yours where you described the innocence of childhood, which is lovely, but not everyone lives like that.
“During my childhood I was bullied violently for years; I was also bullied at home and regularly got a clip round the earhole from my dad who told me, ‘Why are you talking like a poof?’
“Why are you not appalled by the number of transgender children who have attempted suicide? Not considered suicide, attempted suicide. What right have you got to come on here and say kids haven’t got the right to wear what they want?”
Phillip Schofield waded in: “Let’s debate this sensibly please.”
Angela raged: “You’re doing what the transgender lobby do – you’re steam rolling me. I’m talking about promoting this in a school and uniform is there for uniformity.”
Phillip’s co-host Holly Willoughby, 36, chipped in: “Girls can wear trousers…”
“That’s a health issue,” stressed Angela.
Clearly disgruntled, Holly defended Paris, adding: “You keep saying they’re promoting it, but surely they’re just making it less of an issue. It’s only because it’s a change, but then it becomes the norm.”
After admitting she didn’t agree with girls wearing trousers, Paris let out a noticeable sigh.
“Why are you rolling your eyes?” said Phillip. “I think we can safely say you’re both sick of each other. Oh lord…”
Paris concluded: “By that same argument, maybe gay people shouldn’t have kids because they’ll be bullied. The problem isn’t the isn’t the change, it’s the bullying – if we taught children to accepting of each other maybe we wouldn’t have this problem.
“People used to hate the idea of gay teachers 30 years ago.”
Turning to Angela, she finished: “Don’t pretend that you care about pre transgender kids being bullied.”
Piers Morgan and Charlotte Hawkins were embroiled in their own row over gender-neutrality on Good Morning Britain today.
This Morning airs weekdays at 10.30am on ITV.
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